Mariottini, Thank you for this post and the references. The question of who King Lemuel was came up during Bible Study and I gained good information here to further my research. I am happy to know that you enjoyed reading my post on Lemuel. If you look at the Archive page of my blog, you will probably find other posts that you may also enjoy reading. Thank you for the information about Lemuel.
It is helpful to be able to quickly find info although it took you sometime to gather. I appreciate your blog. Again, thank you! Thank you for your comment on Lemuel. There are two things we know about Lemuel. First, we know that Lemuel was not Solomon. Many people refuse to give up on the idea that Lemuel was another name for Solomon. Second, we know that Lemuel was not an Israelite king.
The writer of Proverbs saw that the advice Lemuel received from his mother taught him many truths, so he decided to incorporate those words in his writings. Instructive Commentary on the name Lemuel. Will contact on more Biblical Topics. Timothy Nyarango.
I am glad to know you enjoyed reading my post on Lemuel. If you visit the Archive page of my blog, you will find many other topics that you can read and enjoy. I really like the article on who is king Lemuel. When things of this nature come about it the bible. The only thing I do is remember what God said in his word.
We only know half of the story. In this case we only need to read the Word of God for what it is. In some cases it could be the opposite sex. Which is a lot of men down fall. What we find in Proverbs 31 is an important lesson that people need to learn. In reading about King Lemuel, it is interesting to note your claim that Proverbs proves that Solomon did not write the book of Proverbs.
Clearly Solomon complied the bulk of the proverbs from chapter After all, are not scholars and authors likely to continue to write after completing one or more works? And even die in the midst of their work? It would incredulous to assert Pascal did not author the material simply because the cover sites these men as authors. Even with inspired authors God does not merely turn on an information spigot from heaven directly to their pens.
Although God anointed certain individuals to speak for him, he still loves to use regular human interactions and relationships in the process of inspiration and inscripturation.
Surely I am mistaken in understanding your assertion. Please correct me at your convenience. Then, there are the proverbs of Agur Prov.
It is clear that Solomon wrote many proverbs, but somebody else collected these proverbs and put them together in the form of a book. Thus, Solomon did not write the book of Proverbs. Rather, he wrote many proverbs in the book of Proverbs. Amriottini, I have an additional question, that being about Amen-em-apt and Proverbs — It seems interesting to me that most scholars seems to always assume that if there are any parallels between scripture and extra-biblical writings that it is assumed that it is the Hebrews scholars that have borrowed the material, and not the reverse.
Do you have any comment about this? How plausible is this? The date for Amen-em-apt is generally accepted to be — BCE. Solomon reigned from BCE. Thus, Amen-em-apt could not have borrowed from Solomon. The changes in Egyptian chronology that you have proposed is rejected by most Egyptologists. Claude Mariottini — Professor of Old. Tks very much! The section on the virtuous woman probably was taught to Lemuel by his mother. We are not sure about who wrote those beautiful words, but they describe the character of a noble woman.
Thank you for visiting my blog. I hope you have subscribed to my blog so that you can receive future posts by email. Good day, Dr Claude Mariottini. But please i need nothing but the truth about it. Lemuel was not a Christian. He was king of Massa, a tribal group in the old Edomite territory.
Please my Dr. Thanks More Grace to you sir. Yes I very much like your research on the name Lemuel. I have a grandson named Lemuel….. Named after his great uncle who was killed in the Normandy invasion of WW Uncle Lemuel was an extremely outstanding young man growing up in our small community of Harned Kentucky.
My Lemuel is eight years old and Zi want to teach him everything I can find about his name. Thank you so much!! Your son has a great name and I hope he grows old to become as wise as the biblical Lemuel was. Thank you for the info on the name Lemuel since my maiden name is Limuel and have always wondered where the name came from and it was also rumored it was originally spelled Lemuel.. Ivy Limuel-Thomas. You have a great name. Wow I never knew that , great lesson taught there, will be asking more questions for myself later sir.
Mariottini Thank you, Rickey Valentine. There is always much that we need to learn from the Bible. I am glad to know that my post was helpful to your study of the Bible.
Hello professor, my name is Jean. Your commentary on Proverbs , left me with more question, than answers! The first verse said that it was a prophecy from his mother! Verses is in the first person singular. Verses is in second person singular. I am not convinced that Lemuel and Solomon are the same Kings. The name does not appear in any other place in the bible. The only other place that the name appear in is verse four of the same chapter. One would ascertain, also, if Solomom wrote this book, that he would use his known name and not a name that people who are reading the exhortation, would not be familiar with, since names are of great importance to Hebrew people.
I looked up the name because, this woman made a vow, and I wanted to find out what the vow was that she made, but could not. Thank you for reading my response. Verses is the mother addressing the king: the text is in the second person singular, not in the first person singular.
Verses describes the capable wife: the text is in the third person feminine singular, not the second person singular. You are right: Lemuel and Solomon are not the same person. This was the whole intent of my post. The words of Proverbs 31 are not the words of a vow, but are the exhortation of a mother to her son. Pingback: Solomon L. Kane — mountains of madness. Thank you for your post about King Lemuel. I appreciated your discussion of other theories, and then reasons for the most plausible.
Thank you for sharing and empowering others in the Word. There are many different views on Lemuel, but the fact is that Solomon was not Lemuel. Many people still refuse to accept this truth. Hi professor, thank you for your post about Lemuel. I am currently studying the book of Proverbs. I am a member of a Baptist church here in the UAE and we have regular activities in the ladies ministry every Wednesday in our ladies bible study.
It is gratifying to know that the ladies of your group are studying every book of the Bible. I commend you and your group for such a dedication to know and learn more about the Bible. Many people refuse to believe that Lemuel was not Solomon. Traditional commentaries try to defend a view that is wrong and does not agree with what the Bible says. Lemuel was king of Massa and not king of Israel. Pingback: Virtuous Who? Check the Archive section of my blog and you will find many good posts listed there that may be of interest to you.
No one is quote Ishmael in the article. The fact is that the King of Massa was an Ishmaelite and he was from the family of Ishmael. The argument is more logical than the others. You may believe that Lemuel was Solomon, but that does not make it so. Solomon and Lemuel were two different persons. You may believe that King Lemuel and King Solomon were two different people, but that does not make it so.
Mariottini, I just wanted to leave a note to let you know that I struggled long and hard to find a thorough, logical explanation of who King Lemuel could possibly be and that yours has helped tremendously at last. Thank you very much! Thank you for your nice words.
People struggle with Lemuel because they cannot accept the fact that Lemuel was not Solomon. I wish you well as you write your paper. Claude, Great thorough work! Lemuel is poetic name for Solomon. Bathsheba was like prophet king David was very virtuous as her husband was Uriah. I can see a mom whose first husband was like Uriah and second like David being furious at son per story drunk and hungover.
And like Ecclesiastes so ends Proverbs with perfect advice against marrying non-believers and showing who a good woman is to marry. Those Pharisees who would have cast stones are wrong not to think Bathseba could be very virtuous.
Proverbs [2] What, my son? See All Proverbs The words of king Lemuel, the prophecy that his mother taught him. This has left the door open to all kinds of speculation as to his true identity. He has been thought by interpreters to be imaginary, to be Solomon himself, to be Hezekiah, to be a Lemuel who was king of Massa a play on the Hebrew words , or just some petty Arabian prince. In other words, no one really knows. The name means "to God" and has the implication of "belonging to God.
Personally, I think the name and context points to a poetic reference to Solomon. In Ecclesiastes, Solomon never uses his own name but presents himself seven times as the "Preacher" Ecclesiastes The words of the Preacher, the son of David, king in Jerusalem. The shift in emphasis in Proverbs would call for a different construction. Through most of Proverbs, Solomon is giving words of wisdom to his son. In Proverbs 31, King Lemuel is repeating the words of wisdom given to him by his mother.
The advice is clearly advice that Solomon needed to hear. Lemuel's mother warned her son against giving his strength unto women Proverbs Give not thy strength unto women, nor thy ways to that which destroyeth kings.
This problem directly led to Solomon's decline in later years 1 Kings [1] But king Solomon loved many strange women, together with the daughter of Pharaoh, women of the Moabites, Ammonites, Edomites, Zidonians, and Hittites: [2] Of the nations concerning which the LORD said unto the children of Israel, Ye shall not go in to them, neither shall they come in unto you: for surely they will turn away your heart after their gods: Solomon clave unto these in love.
She also warned against strong drink Proverbs [4] It is not for kings, O Lemuel, it is not for kings to drink wine; nor for princes strong drink: [5] Lest they drink, and forget the law, and pervert the judgment of any of the afflicted. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Who is King Lemuel in Proverbs 31? I did a search for King Lemuel in my entire library of encyclopedias, commentaries, Bible dictionaries, etc.
Some see him as a descendent of Ishmael depending on how one answers the previous question on Proverbs Not that I have a whole lot to add because as you have already noted there is not much to go on as to Lemuel might have been. Longman in his Dictionary of the Old Testament points out a very old issue that dates back to the time of the Septuagint: 1 Some Jewish sources have Agur and Lemuel as noms de plume a Latin phrases for alias for Solomon. That is why the LXX and the Latin Vulgate do not even recognize these two terms as proper names at all.
If this is the case then a very interesting thing emerges from the text -- this wisdom is coming into the text via Bathsheba because in this case Lemuel is another name for Solomon. Bathsheba would have had a unique contribution to the issues found in this chapter. This would have a powerful impact on the text but it depends to a large extent on Jewish Tradition which here is divided.
This is very sparse material, Longman mentions the noms de plume aspect but not the significance of it as identifying the mother. After finding this I did a quick search and even the Wiki page for Lemuel mentions that the mother of Proverbs 31 may have been Bathsheba.
The term Massa comes into the picture through the Hebrew as a change in the punctuation. A useful resource aside from the tools I have in Logos that can be helpful from time to time is the Jewish Encyclopedia site that is online.
There are a lot of references to Lemuel on that site. After a basic search one of the more interesting ones is that Massa was related to the Kedemites, who were known for their wisdom. The Kedemites enjoyed among the Israelites a great reputation for wisdom. Not only does David quote a Kedemite proverb which he characterizes as such, but the wisdom of the Kedemites is rated only lower than Solomon's though higher than that of the Egyptians I Kings , and Isaiah represents the Egyptian king's wise men as seeking to impress him by claiming descent from sages of Kedem this, not "of old," is the meaning of qedem in Isa.
The reputed wisdom of the Edomites included among the Kedemites in Isa.
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